The price of art is a funny, funny thing. I remember seeing a macro photograph of some water for $900 at a museum in Southern California when we were there last month and thinking, “Kamran’s 3-year-old niece could’ve accidentally shot that if we handed her a camera.” I think the venerable OOF painting is wonderful . . . but wouldn’t pay more than the cost of materials for it. I appreciate that our society values art, but I just don’t know how you determine what any of it’s worth.
I guess it’s worth whatever someone will pay for it, right? Well, so, my friend Anthony has been making these decorative picture frames lately. I know that decorative picture frames are going to put you in the mind of, like, wood painted magenta and covered in plastic fairy princess hats and the words Daddy’s Little Future Golddigger or something, so let me just show you some examples:
Not lame, right? The project kind of started as an accident, but now he’s really enjoying it, and I’m really encouraging him to make some money off of it. Neither of us has any idea what you charge for something like that, though.
These window frames were free, but it’s unlikely that future ones always will be. He has about $50 worth of copper in the background of the third frame, and the others all have fabric and matting costs. There’s the time spent burning the edges of the frame or weathering the paint. And if he uses his own pictures, there’s the effort it takes to edit and print each photo. Plus, there’s also the “am I willing to make this myself?” factor, and no, I’m not willing to make this myself.
So, how much would you pay for it? If you saw it on Etsy or eBay, what price would get you interested? Is there a price that would turn you away?
I told Anthony not to read this post so you’ll feel free to be more honest, but you can also comment anonymously, if you like. (Just use katie @ unapologeticallymundane.com for the e-mail address, since my comment system requires one.)
29 Comments
As an artist, I’m HORRIBLE at pricing. When people told me I could charge upwards of a 150 or 200 bucks for a simple 8×10 shading, I about crapped my pants.
So I’m not a good person to ask.
That’s the thing, though. Those drawings take a crapload of work. (And are amazing.) You COULD charge $900 for those. Not for a picture of water.
Is the question of price for just the frames themselves, or also the pictures inside? The examples you showed make it clear that he put effort into matching the look of the pictures with the look of the frame, which amounts to the piece as a whole looking better.
That being said, I have no sense of how much art is worth, so will just throw out some numbers (note that I am part Jewish, and also think that the OOF painting should be worth at most a nickel).
Frame alone: $150
Frame including pictures sent by customer: $300
The question is for the frames and pictures. He’d like either for the client to send him pictures or to request the use of his own pictures, so each frame would very much be a custom project.
I’m glad you’re even meaner about the OOF than I am. For $300, I’m sure Anthony would make a Poland-themed one for you and your brothers and sister to give to your mom for Christmas. Hint, hint.
I think the price is just going to be limited because the art inside the frames is not original. Plus, if he really wants criticism, I think that they’re too busy. I like a little bit more negative space around my art. And I think the creators of the originals would probably like that more, too.
All that said, I don’t think you could ask more than a couple hundred for them.
Now, as a scrapbook sort of memento project wherein people send their own photos from a trip or wedding or a kid or something, they could actually have more promise. Potentially even higher value, but you have to then consider things like archival glass and materials, etc., which I have no idea if he’s already doing.
Oh, yeah, so these originally started as a way for Anthony to display photos he likes, but he’s actually a very talented photographer himself, so a lot of what you see here are his photos. He’s thinking he would either use his own work or let clients send in their digital files for him to edit, ’cause he’s a genius Photoshopper.
I think you can buy archival spray, right? I seem to remember Tracey telling me that any paper can be made archival. But yeah, that’s a great point.
Unfortunately, he won’t get much money for his frames. I have stolen Anthony’s idea and have contracted a factory in China which is already churning out 200 frames a day at a cost of $5 each.
His are almost certainly of a superior quality, as well as significantly less like to cause nose and throat cancer than mine. But mine will sell for $8 at Bed, Bath & Beyond and finer street fairs around NYC.
Don’t forget to list them on Etsy as handmade. I mean, them Chinese kids gots hands, amirite?
Mangled little frame-making stubs. Because of YOU.
The “finer street fairs” really did it for me.
Honestly, given the work that goes into those, I’d say $250, but I certainly wouldn’t pay that. I’m a total DYI-er when it comes to art.
Erm, I meant DIY-er. Except when it comes to spelling.
Yeah, I’m totally the same way. Especially with clothes, the difference between what I think it’s worth and what I’ll pay for it are miles apart, since I know I could sew it if I really needed to. I’m glad you could think of a normal-people-price, though.
I love the fact that the comments are as good as the post. NOT that your post isn’t good – it is, but the quality of the comments is also so high.
Until now.
That said, I very much agree w/ serial above. I like the idea, but there’s too much going on for my taste. I love the weathered frames and esp. like the plain wood one (the last) but the red polka dot print really detracts from it. I guess my gut reaction is great frame but – less is more. Try the frame with a simple matte background – cream or white, even black – and let the photos do the talking. No burnt edges necessary.
Hope this helps!
Yeah, I was so sure that either people would have no idea what to say or that they wouldn’t want to be honest about it, but everyone has legitimate, helpful comments! Well, except for thickcrust, but I love him anyway.
I thought the red polka dot one would be good for a very specific customer who wants something reeeeeeeeally country, but the faint white polka dots on the black is my favourite, so maybe I’m in the less is more camp, too. I don’t think you’ll talk Anthony into putting down his blowtorch, though!
I do like the third photo compilation a LOT – the one w/ the very bright pics and weathered frame. I can totally see that in a restaurant or bar for some reason.
The third one is the first one he made! Anthony’s a snob, so I won’t tell him that you want to see these in Applebee’s, but I totally agree.
I wish I could answer that… I’ve only sold 4 things and that still surprises the double hockey sticks out of me.
What bothers me is the ‘shocked’ look on people’s faces when you won’t sell a piece for twenty bucks (after tying up money, materials and countless hours). It’s insulting – if someone doesn’t want to buy, that’s fine, no problem – but don’t look at me like I’m from the moon if I turn down an offer of 50 cents an hour for a result I like enough to hang on my wall.
Yikes – that turned into a rant… sorry about that, U.M.! :)
No, I totally understand. I would especially consider what you do art, but I think most of us are used to walking into IKEA or Target or whatever and seeing the prices on mass-produced pictures. When someone tries to legitimately charge us for their time and effort on an original, singular piece, we freak out.
How do you ever decide how to price your stuff, though? When you’re taking pictures with a camera you already own and editing them with a program you already own, it has to be more than the cost of the materials and a little extra for your time, or you’d never be able to upgrade your camera and editing program over time. If you’re charging as much as you need to make in a year divided by how many you expect to sell, you may be charging too much for anyone to ever buy.
But, like, I’ve been looking into it, and aaaaaall of the NYC wedding photographers seem to charge $3000 just for their time. On one hand, that seems insane when you consider that clients are then spending hundreds more on prints. That’s, like, $250 an hour. On the other hand, I would want someone to put a LOT of effort into my wedding. And also, if I ever do become a wedding photographer, I want to actually make a living at it and not try to live on $500 every other month or something.
Endlessly interesting stuff.
Unfortunately I can’t afford most art I’d like to buy (or, at the moment, even books etc. that people are putting out). If someone can’t afford a piece I completely understand – no problem, really – it’s when people give you dirty looks or make rude comments that I get a bit irritated.
(I guess I was initially referring to my mixed media stuff which usually includes drawing, painting, etc. – a completely one of a kind thing, and often has a surprising amount of material cost involved, too.)
Some people use a formula: material cost + decent hourly rate and/or additional percentage (a larger scale piece can demand more $, too). When it comes to photographs, limiting the total number of prints you sell can raise asking price, too. As far as wedding photography goes, I have no clue – although I know some very talented people if you ever have specific questions on that front.
I’m obviously a hack at all this (which explains my clunking around with a 6.25mp camera and other very outdated equipment).
The whole situation of buying art straight from the artist is scary for me. I love going to craft fairs when I can afford the stuff I’m looking at, but that moment when the artist can tell I’m really interested in something and then back off when I see the price just feels so icky to me. I want everyone to get rich off their art!
Imagining one of your mixed media pieces and someone wanting to pay $20 makes me sick to my stomach.
I don’t know if I have specific questions yet, but I’d love to see some of your wedding photographer friends’ work if they have it posted anywhere!
Here’s a link to Kelly & Ian’s website…
if you are interested in wedding photography and have a few minutes I would definitely recommend checking it out…
they do amazing work…
http://www.kellyprattphoto.com/
I have to agree that for me, these are a bit busy. I would try to keep it one picture per frame and MUCH less going on with the backgrounds. Let the frames do the work as they are very well done.
Framing any art is expensive, so I think if he can get the general aesthetic down (really work to make the frames compliment the artwork and not overwhelm it), he could ask quite a bit for custom creations – Easily in the $200 range if not more. Maybe he could hook up with a fine art photographer/artist and do custom framing for a gallery or something. They are used to paying a lot to frame their work (if they are planning to sell the frames along with the prints), so they wouldn’t balk at that price range, I imagine.
I agree that the frames are beautiful on their own. And you’re right that the pictures should be the focus, especially since this guy is capable of doing amazing things in Photoshop; he can make any boring picture look like genuine art with some manipulation.
Interesting thought about trying to sell to galleries. I would have no idea how to break into something like that, but maybe he does. I think I’d be a horrible artist who’d sell everything for $10 just because I couldn’t imagine anyone else liking it.
I’d say somewhere in the $200 range. And I think Numbers 1, 2 and 4 are his best work.
Noted and appreciated!
I did a quick search for similar stuff on Etsy to see what artists there are charging, and it seems like 11×14 and larger handmade frames (without photos or art) are going for $50-100. Small “digital art prints” range from $3-$35 each, so maybe he could total up a charge for the frame and then separately per print in order to find out the price for the each piece?
Good for him, by the way. Does he have any interest in making other distressed wood stuff? Like furniture or clocks?
Hey, good idea, smartypants. I guess the twist is that he doesn’t make the frames himself but does do all the work to them, so I’m not sure if you charge more or less for that. I think a per-print cost is a pretty fine idea, though.
This is still a pretty new venture for him, but we’ll see where it takes him. I not-so-secretly want him to be the photo-editor for my wedding photography venture, but I suppose he can make some chairs and clocks on the side.
Wow, look so beautiful. I always meant to go to The Hamptons when i lived in CT, but never got round to it. Wish I had now!